Summary

  • The reviewed public record visibly distinguishes sponsorship invitations and sponsor-role labels from a Program Committee process that reviews submissions and applies a stated limit on promotional or proprietary vendor presentations. That distinction is evidence of separate public descriptions, not proof of a complete operational firewall.
  • The same record does not establish funding terms, selection rights, individual conflicts, recusals, scores, rule dispositions, influence, non-influence, or any technical outcome. A proportionate improvement would be a privacy-conscious aggregate record of benefits, roles, broad conflict handling, review stages, and content-rule dispositions.

The question is not whether support is allowed

Technical meetings need rooms, connectivity, staff time, social space, accessible participation arrangements, and many other forms of practical support. Sponsorship is one familiar way to help meet those needs. It can also provide an opportunity for a company or institution to be visible to a community whose work it follows or contributes to. None of that is inherently suspect. A meeting that refuses to distinguish legitimate support from improper control will often be unable to explain either one.

The public concern begins somewhere more precise. A reader may encounter a sponsor label close to a programme page, a sponsored break close to a session list, or an invitation to support a meeting beside a call for technical content. The visual arrangement can invite a question about whether financial support and agenda choice are connected. But visual arrangement is not causal evidence. It can show that two kinds of meeting activity are publicly visible at once. It cannot, by itself, tell a reader who made a decision, what rights were attached to a contribution, or whether a particular submission was preferred, rejected, altered, or recused.

That distinction matters because two errors are tempting. The first is to treat the presence of a separate Program Committee description as a conclusive guarantee that no commercial pressure can ever matter. The second is to treat the presence of a sponsor label as conclusive proof that it did matter. Both errors convert a limited public record into a claim it does not bear. The more careful position is that the record supplies a starting architecture for scrutiny, while leaving key operational questions unanswered.

NANOG’s material offers a useful case for that careful position. The reviewed notices describe a Program Committee process for technical content. They also publicly describe sponsorship visibility and event support. A 2026 call for content says that proposals and draft slides are reviewed, that a shepherd may be assigned, that submissions are evaluated for the agenda, and that accepted speakers are notified. It says vendor presentations may cover relevant technologies and capabilities, while also saying that such talks should not be promotional or discuss proprietary solutions. Those are discernible public commitments about a content path.

They are not a public audit of every decision made along it.

What the public file positively shows

The most defensible first step is descriptive rather than accusatory. The record shows that NANOG has publicly spoken about sponsorship as community visibility and about the Program Committee as a body that shapes a meeting agenda through technical-content review. It also shows event notices in which agenda material or Program Committee intake appears separately from sponsorship opportunities, sponsored events, or sponsor-role labels. Older materials show comparable elements: a content-review path, a stated non-promotional and non-proprietary limit, and a local-host reference in the event context.

There is value in naming that separation accurately. Public notices can make a reader see different lanes: one for an invitation or label associated with support and one for submissions or agenda development. They can make the stated standards legible. They can show that the meeting presents technical review as a recognisable function rather than merely an informal consequence of whoever is visible around the event. They can also show that sponsorship is not hidden. Visibility, however, is a beginning of accountability, not the end of it.

The 2026 description is particularly important because it contains more than a generic reference to a programme. It describes review of proposals and draft slides, possible assignment of a shepherd, evaluation for the agenda, and notification after acceptance. These are process terms. A process term tells a reader that the organisation publicly represents content selection as involving stages rather than a single public announcement. The statement about vendor presentations adds a different kind of term: a boundary on the kind of material considered suitable for the meeting.

It is a content rule, not an account of the rule’s application in any particular case.

The public record also contains event-specific examples of coexistence. Materials for NANOG 90 and NANOG 93 display agenda or Program Committee intake alongside sponsorship opportunities or sponsored events. The NANOG 95 page displays a host-sponsor surface while indicating that additional talks would appear as Program Committee submissions were accepted. A NANOG 69 notice identifies host and connectivity sponsors while linking readers toward the programme. Taken together, these notices show that sponsorship and programme surfaces can be visible in the same public environment without being described as the same process.

This is not a trivial observation. A governance claim needs some observable object. If a meeting did not publicly distinguish content review from sponsor visibility at all, readers would have little to examine except rumours, branding, or retrospective impressions. Here, readers can at least compare a declared content pathway with a declared support pathway. They can ask whether the two are described in compatible ways. They can ask whether the public record would enable an outsider to see the difference between a sponsor benefit and a programme decision. Those questions are more useful than broad assertions about purity or capture.

What the file cannot establish

The reviewed public record does not establish a funding term. It does not say what a sponsor paid, what was negotiated, whether a contribution was cash or in-kind, whether benefits changed over time, or whether any benefit carried a right to request a particular speaker, session, theme, or placement. A sponsorship invitation can describe visibility without disclosing a contract. A sponsor label can identify a category without explaining the legal or operational terms behind it. To move from a label to a claim about decision rights would be speculation.

Nor does the reviewed public record establish that a specific conflict existed. A person might have an employer, an affiliation, a professional relationship, or an interest relevant to a meeting. But none of those possibilities alone establishes a conflict that required action. Even where a conflict exists, the public record reviewed here does not identify whether it was declared, how it was assessed, whether a recusal occurred, how broad a recusal was, or whether any associated decision altered an agenda. It would be wrong to turn ordinary professional proximity into an allegation of compromised judgment.

The same restraint applies to selection. The source set does not disclose submission scores, review comments, comparative rankings, reasons for acceptance or rejection, changes requested by a shepherd, or the sequence of deliberation. It does not establish whether a particular proposal was stronger, weaker, more timely, more operationally useful, more novel, or more aligned with a meeting’s announced needs than another proposal. A reader cannot reconstruct a selection decision from a sponsor label and an eventual agenda. An agenda is an output; it is not a complete decision record.

The public record also does not establish enforcement. A stated rule against promotional or proprietary vendor presentations is meaningful as a declared standard. But a declared standard is not proof that every presentation complied, proof that no proposal was rejected, proof that a violation was found, or proof that a particular committee response occurred. The record does not identify individual rule dispositions. It does not give a reader a basis to label a specific talk promotional, proprietary, censored, favoured, or improperly handled.

Most importantly, the material does not establish influence or non-influence. Influence is an empirical claim about a relationship between an interest and a decision. Non-influence is likewise an empirical claim. The existence of an independent-sounding process description does not prove that influence was impossible. The existence of support or visibility does not prove influence occurred. A sound public analysis must leave room for both possibilities without pretending that either has been demonstrated by the available record.

Why a visible distinction still matters

Some readers will ask why it is worth examining a distinction that does not prove independence. The answer is that public governance often begins with claims that are weaker than proof but stronger than silence. A published statement of who reviews content, what materials may be reviewed, and what kinds of presentations are not supposed to be promotional gives participants a reference point. It makes later questions more disciplined. The reader can ask whether a public description exists, whether it is stable, whether it is intelligible, and whether it would be possible to improve its testability.

The alternative to a visible distinction is not necessarily transparency; it may simply be ambiguity. Ambiguity can protect confidentiality, but it can also make ordinary support look more suspect than it is because no shared vocabulary separates support from selection. A meeting organiser may know that logistical funding and agenda review are handled by different people or at different stages. If public material offers no way to see even the categories of that distinction, outside observers must infer structure from adjacency. That is a poor basis for trust and an equally poor basis for criticism.

At the same time, a visible distinction can become a rhetorical shortcut if it is too thin. A reader may be told that sponsorship and programme review are separate, but still have no information about what the separation entails. Does the distinction concern staff assignment, approval authority, data access, decision rights, written policy, recusal practice, or merely a description on a webpage? The reviewed record does not answer those questions. A responsible article should therefore resist calling the visible distinction a firewall. A firewall implies a defined barrier, a scope, a mechanism, and some basis for testing whether it operated.

The public notices establish none of those things in full.

The phrase “agenda firewall” is useful only if it is treated as a standard a reader could inspect, not a slogan that closes inquiry. A boundary has practical content when it says what is on each side, who is permitted to cross it, what happens when an interest is relevant, and which facts can be reported without exposing protected information. Without those elements, an assurance of separation may still be well-intentioned, but it is difficult for an outsider to evaluate.

The strongest case for restraint

The case for more public intelligibility must start by taking restraint seriously. Sponsorship agreements can include commercially sensitive terms. Publishing every amount, negotiation, benefit, or contact could deter support, distort bargaining, or expose information that competitors could misuse. A technical meeting also depends on volunteers, staff, presenters, and reviewers who should not be asked to make their private professional relationships into a public spectacle merely because they serve a community function.

Unpublished submissions require protection for similar reasons. A proposal may contain preliminary operational information, an unannounced product direction, a security-sensitive observation, or an idea that a speaker has not yet decided to disclose publicly. Review comments can be candid precisely because they are not written for public contest. A regime that promised universal disclosure of drafts, individual scores, or disagreements could discourage useful submissions and make reviewers more guarded. It could reduce rather than improve the quality of technical discussion.

Small-number disclosure is another genuine problem. An aggregate that appears anonymous can reveal a person or a decision when there are only one or two submissions in a category, one reviewer with a particular role, or one obvious sponsor relationship. This article does not treat NANOG as a regulator or infer any statutory reporting duty from the reviewed record. Its disclosure design should fit a voluntary technical community rather than imitate institutions with statutory reporting mandates.

There is also a substantive reason not to treat vendor expertise as tainted. People employed by vendors can possess direct operational knowledge of equipment, software, network behaviour, deployment conditions, and emerging constraints. A rule against promotional or proprietary presentation does not mean such expertise has no place; the 2026 public call explicitly recognises that relevant technologies and capabilities may be discussed. The governance problem is not to exclude expertise by employer category. It is to keep a technical programme legible as technical even when commercial actors participate.

Finally, an event can have legitimate reasons to recognise support publicly. A sponsor label may be an agreed benefit, a signal of appreciation, a way to help participants understand what services are available, or a practical component of a funding model. Public recognition is not identical to editorial control. Treating it as identical would create a false choice between hiding support and accusing supporters. A better approach preserves recognition while describing, in proportionate terms, the role that recognition does and does not entail.

The governance problem is testability, not theatre

If full disclosure would be excessive and the existing file is incomplete, what should change? The answer should not be a demand for a public courtroom around every agenda decision. It should be a limited record that lets a reader test the most basic claim: that sponsorship benefits and programme selection occupy distinct governance roles. The record should describe categories and stages, not expose personal files.

One useful design principle is functional separation. Instead of asking an organisation to reveal every internal communication, ask it to identify in plain language whether the function that negotiates or administers sponsor benefits is distinct from the function that reviews submissions for the programme. “Distinct” need not mean socially isolated, legally independent, or untouched by any common administration. It can mean that one function does not decide content acceptance merely by virtue of handling sponsorship, and that the content-review function is described separately enough for readers to understand its remit.

A second principle is aggregation. The record can state a sponsor benefit category without disclosing an amount. It can state that a selection function is distinct without naming every reviewer. It can report a general conflict or recusal category without exposing the identity, employer, or personal details of a person involved. It can report, in aggregate, how a stated content rule is treated at a named review stage without identifying a rejected submission. The purpose is not to create a dossier. It is to make a claim of separation falsifiable at the level at which the public can responsibly inspect it.

A third principle is bounded non-disclosure. The record should say what it is not reporting and why. It might state that negotiation terms, individual declarations, unpublished submissions, detailed review comments, and small cells are withheld to protect commercial confidence, privacy, and the integrity of review. That is not evasive if the boundaries are explicit. On the contrary, a clear non-disclosure statement can make the disclosed aggregate more credible because readers can see the limits rather than being left to assume that silence means either secrecy or innocence.

A minimal aggregate record

The first field should be a sponsor benefit category. The relevant question is not “who bought the agenda?” because the reviewed record does not support that premise. The question is what public category of recognition or event support is associated with a sponsorship arrangement. A category might distinguish general visibility, event-service support, hosted social activity, or other broad forms of benefit if those are used. It need not disclose a price, a negotiation, a contract clause, or a bespoke arrangement. The point is to give readers a stable vocabulary for understanding what a sponsor label signifies.

The second field should state the distinct selection role. It should identify, at a general level, the role or function responsible for reviewing technical submissions and evaluating them for the agenda. The existing public descriptions already point toward a Program Committee reviewing proposals and draft slides, possibly assigning a shepherd, and evaluating submissions for the agenda. A minimal record would not need to publish names, votes, or correspondence.

It would clarify whether sponsor-benefit administration has any formal selection authority, advisory authority, or access to content-review information beyond what is publicly announced.

The third field should be a general conflict and recusal category. This field should never become a list of people to scrutinise. It could instead report whether relevant interests were handled under a general recusal or conflict process, whether no reportable instance occurred in an aggregate period, or whether a category was too small to report. The wording must make clear that an aggregate category is not a conclusion about anyone’s integrity. It is a way to describe how a meeting manages the possibility that a relevant interest and a programme decision may coincide.

The fourth field should be the review stage. The public descriptions speak of proposals, draft slides, possible shepherding, and evaluation for the agenda. A record can use those stages to show where the non-promotional and non-proprietary boundary is considered, without revealing a specific submission. For example, it can say that content rules are considered during a particular stage of review, or that material may receive shepherding before final agenda evaluation. It need not state what an individual speaker changed, what a reviewer wrote, or which proposal received which disposition.

The fifth field should be an aggregate content-rule disposition. This is the most delicate category. It should not publish a list of talks labelled promotional or proprietary. It could instead describe aggregate outcomes in a reporting period: for example, whether the rule was considered, whether material was revised through the ordinary review path, whether a category is too small to disclose, or whether the available aggregate is not meaningful. The language must avoid creating a misleading impression that absence of a public count proves absence of a problem.

It should be clear about its denominator, time period, and non-disclosure threshold.

The sixth field should be the non-disclosure boundary itself. A reader who sees only five positive fields may reasonably wonder what has been omitted. The record should plainly identify the kinds of information withheld: negotiation terms, personal conflict detail, unpublished submissions, individual scores, review comments, and small cells. It should say that the omission is designed to protect commercial confidence, privacy, and review integrity. This makes the disclosure a governed object rather than an accidental collage of safe facts.

What this record would and would not prove

Even a well-designed aggregate would not prove moral independence in every case. It would not establish that every person acted without bias. It would not prove that no informal pressure existed. It would not establish that every decision was optimal, that every presentation was valuable, or that a sponsor never had a view about a programme. Governance records rarely prove the absence of all influence. Their value is more modest and more durable: they make defined claims inspectable and make unexplained deviations more visible.

The record could, however, change the quality of public debate. A reader would no longer need to infer the meaning of a sponsor label from its proximity to an agenda. They could see a broad category of benefit, a separately described content-selection role, a general way of handling relevant interests, and an account of where the content rule belongs in review. They could also see the limits of disclosure. This would make both reassurance and criticism more precise. A person alleging influence would need more than co-location. A person asserting separation would need more than a general assurance.

The aggregate should be reported at a cadence that does not fabricate precision. A per-event report may be possible in some settings; a periodic report may better protect small groups in others. The public record reviewed here does not establish which cadence NANOG uses or should use. That choice should follow the size of the relevant activity, the risk of re-identification, and the usefulness of the resulting category. A report that contains only zeros, one-person cells, or empty labels may create more spectacle than insight.

The terminology should also resist moralising. “Conflict” need not imply misconduct; it can identify a situation in which a relevant interest deserves a process response. “Recusal” need not imply guilt; it can be a protective act that preserves confidence in a decision. “Sponsor benefit” need not imply control; it can name a category of visibility or support. “Content-rule disposition” need not imply censorship; it can describe a review outcome under a publicly stated standard. Careful language allows a record to be informative without converting normal governance safeguards into accusations.

Authority and incentives

The authority question is central because it determines whether a boundary is real or merely decorative. Public notices can tell a reader that a Program Committee reviews content, but the reviewed record does not map every authority held by staff, volunteers, sponsors, hosts, or other participants. A useful aggregate record should therefore name authority at the level of functions. It can say which function accepts or evaluates technical submissions, which function administers sponsor benefits, and whether one has a formal role in the other’s decisions. It need not expose a private organisational chart or individual responsibilities.

Incentives need similar discipline. A sponsor may seek visibility, a useful audience, goodwill, recruitment interest, technical exchange, or association with a community. A Programme Committee member may value a coherent agenda, practical relevance, novelty, speaker diversity, operational usefulness, or the feasibility of a session. None of these possible incentives establishes a decision outcome. But incentives are why a reader wants a visible boundary. They explain why the question cannot be settled merely by assuming that good intentions eliminate all governance risk.

The strongest version of the governance case is not that every incentive is corrupting. It is that a community benefits when relevant incentives are channelled through roles that can be described and tested. Technical expertise from commercial participants can improve a programme. Support can make a meeting viable. Volunteer review can maintain standards. These are compatible propositions. They become harder to defend when the public cannot see where one function ends and another begins, or when assurances of separation cannot be translated into observable categories.

Options and their trade-offs

One option is to leave the existing public material as it is. Its advantage is simplicity. Public calls can describe review, event pages can display support, and readers can draw their own conclusions. This avoids new reporting work and reduces the chance of disclosing sensitive information. Its weakness is that readers who notice co-location have little structured material with which to distinguish ordinary support from decision authority. The gap can be filled by unfounded confidence or unfounded suspicion.

A second option is maximal disclosure: publish detailed agreements, all reviewer interests, all submissions, comments, scores, recusal events, and rule dispositions. This option has an intuitive appeal because it appears to leave nothing hidden. It also carries serious costs. It can expose negotiations and personal information, damage candid review, reveal unpublished technical material, and identify people through small numbers. It may encourage performative disputes over fragments of a process rather than improve the quality of the process itself. The public record does not justify such a broad remedy.

A third option is the minimal aggregate record proposed here. It balances the desire for scrutiny against the need for confidentiality. Its weakness is that aggregation can become vague if categories are badly designed, if reporting periods are too broad, or if exceptions are hidden behind generic language. Its strength is that it asks the organisation to describe the governance claims it is already inviting readers to understand: what sponsorship visibility means in general, who reviews content in general, how relevant interests are handled in general, and what is deliberately withheld.

A fourth option is an external audit or independent assurance statement. That could provide stronger evidence of process operation than an internal aggregate. It would also require resources, a defined scope, and agreement about what an auditor may inspect. It could create its own confidentiality questions. The reviewed public record does not establish that such an arrangement exists, is needed for every event, or would be proportionate. It remains an option worth separating from the minimal record rather than presenting as an implied fact or compulsory standard.

Second- and third-order effects

The first-order effect of a clearer record is informational. Readers gain a better vocabulary for distinguishing support from agenda review. The second-order effect is behavioural. Once categories are publicly named, organisers may design roles more carefully because ambiguity becomes visible. Sponsors may also understand the limits of their benefits more clearly, which can reduce mismatched expectations. Reviewers may have a simpler basis for recognising when a relevant interest needs to be handled under an ordinary process.

There are possible negative second-order effects. A disclosure category can harden into a checklist that substitutes for judgment. People may assume that a reported separation category guarantees quality or integrity in every decision. Others may hunt for signals in aggregate reports that the report was designed not to reveal. Small communities are especially vulnerable to inference. A report that is technically aggregated can still become personally legible to insiders. These risks argue for cautious categories, stable thresholds, and explicit explanations of what the data cannot establish.

Third-order effects concern legitimacy. If an organisation makes a broad independence claim and cannot describe the underlying boundary, trust can weaken even when no improper influence occurred. Conversely, if it over-discloses and harms volunteers, submitters, or support relationships, it may weaken the very technical community it seeks to reassure. The durable goal is not maximum visibility. It is a public account whose scope matches the claim being made and whose non-disclosure limits are themselves clear.

Another third-order risk is category drift. A sponsor benefit category might gradually become a proxy for a company, a speaker, or a controversial topic. A conflict category might be read as a register of suspects. A content-rule disposition might be treated as a performance ranking. Good governance design anticipates these misreadings. It avoids categories that are too granular, suppresses small cells, reports context alongside counts, and reminds readers that the record describes processes rather than people.

Irreversible risks

Some disclosure mistakes cannot be undone. Once a private negotiation term, a reviewer’s identity, a sensitive submission, or a small-cell decision becomes public, the harm cannot be recalled by editing a webpage. A participant may be exposed to professional pressure. A company may lose commercial confidence. A speaker may lose control over preliminary work. A volunteer may decide that review is not worth the personal scrutiny. These are not abstract objections; they are reasons to treat minimisation as a positive governance value.

There is an irreversible risk on the other side as well. If a community repeatedly relies on unexplained assurances while sponsor and programme materials remain publicly adjacent, it can make future clarification harder. Rumour can become a substitute archive. People may remember a sponsor label and an agenda placement but have no durable record of roles, boundaries, or ordinary safeguards. The absence of a proportionate record does not prove wrongdoing. It can nevertheless leave a vacuum in which credibility is difficult to rebuild.

The practical response is to decide in advance what should be retained, what should be aggregated, and what should never be published. A stable reporting format is safer than ad hoc disclosure after controversy. It allows an organisation to make the same limited kinds of information available across events while avoiding the temptation to improvise personal detail in response to pressure. It also gives readers a basis for comparison without suggesting that each event has identical circumstances or that variation alone proves a problem.

How a reader should use a bounded record

A reader should use a governance record as a map of questions, not as a machine for producing verdicts. The most useful first question is whether the record clearly separates categories that otherwise appear together on an event page. If a sponsor benefit category, a content-selection role, and a general conflict-handling approach are each named, a reader can see what kind of claim is being made. They can also see whether the claim has changed across reporting periods. That is a more disciplined exercise than attempting to infer authority from a logo, a social event, an employer affiliation, or a talk’s position on an agenda.

The next question is whether the record’s boundaries are intelligible. A reader ought to be able to understand why some information is withheld and whether the reasons make sense for the category at issue. Commercial terms and unpublished submissions have obvious confidentiality interests. Personal declarations can expose private professional detail. Small groups can make anonymous reporting illusory. But a boundary that says only “confidential” without identifying what class of material is protected is less helpful.

The purpose of a bounded non-disclosure statement is to separate legitimate minimisation from an invitation to assume that every unreported fact is either benign or suspicious.

Readers should also attend to consistency without treating every variation as a failure. Different meetings may have different venue arrangements, support needs, submission volumes, or reporting risks. A change in a category can be a normal response to those conditions. The relevant question is whether the change is explained at the same general level as the original record: has the benefit category changed, has the selection role changed, has a disclosure threshold changed, or has a new form of support been introduced? A public account need not reveal the underlying contract to make a change legible.

Finally, a bounded record should make inquiry calmer. If the public material describes separate roles and the limits of disclosure, participants can ask focused questions about whether the categories are adequate rather than turning a meeting’s entire funding model into an allegation. If an anomaly appears, a defined record provides a starting point for further explanation. If no anomaly appears, the record still does not prove perfect independence; it simply reduces the amount of inference required to understand the ordinary design.

That is a meaningful public good in a volunteer and professional community where trust is maintained through repeated, comprehensible practices rather than through a single declaration.

A measured conclusion

The public programme file considered here is neither empty nor conclusive. It shows separate public descriptions of sponsorship visibility, event support, Program Committee review, agenda intake, and a non-promotional and non-proprietary content constraint. It shows that readers can see more than a single undifferentiated event surface. That is valuable. It does not show the terms of support, the details of internal authority, an individual conflict or recusal, a selection score, a rule decision, influence, non-influence, or a technical effect. Those absences are part of the analysis, not gaps to be filled with conjecture.

The right response is not to declare that a sponsor line is harmless because a committee exists. Nor is it to declare that a sponsor line proves agenda control. A sponsor line is a public label. A committee description is a public process claim. Their coexistence raises a governance question that can be made more testable without exposing private negotiations or personal files.

A minimal aggregate record would move the discussion from impression to structure. It would identify broad sponsor-benefit categories, describe the distinct role that selects technical content, state how general conflict or recusal categories are handled, locate content-rule review within the programme path, report aggregate dispositions only where meaningful, and name the commercial, personal, submission, and small-cell boundaries of non-disclosure. Such a record would not certify purity. It would make a modest but important public claim inspectable: that support and selection have defined, intelligible places in the meeting’s governance.

Readers should demand no less than that clarity, and no more than the evidence can sustain. The point of a public record is not to convert a technical meeting into a tribunal. It is to let legitimate support remain legitimate, relevant expertise remain available, confidential work remain protected, and agenda independence become something more concrete than an assurance placed beside a sponsor label.

Sources

  1. https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/[email protected]/2026/6/
  2. https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/[email protected]/latest
  3. https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/[email protected]/2016/6/
  4. https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/[email protected]/thread/3ILZRY7DLXCJYFAGRBVUJRMRIDAVQMNK/
  5. https://nanog.org/events/nanog-95/
  6. https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/[email protected]/2024/2/
  7. https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/[email protected]/2017/2/